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ericablack36

Why do Renault cars devalue so quickly?

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Hi

Please correct me if I am wrong, but it seems to me that Renault cars devalue quickly after purchase from new. I am wondering why that would be the case - assuming my facts are correct?

 

I trust I got this right, but I calculated the following percentage losses of value from purchase price:

2008

R26 = 42 per cent

golf GTI = 30 per cent

 

2009

R26 = 50 per cent

golf GTI = 33 per cent

 

 

It may be the sample above is unrepresentative. But I would be interested to hear the views of member as to why Renault cars don't seem to hold their value.

 

cheers

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theres a great column in top gear mag by james may this month . he says its about buying the car you want , in the colour you want , because you have to drive it . he continues , too many people buy cars they dont 'really want in the colour they dont like because they worry about what some person they don't know and don't care about and who cant even afford a new car might like the look of in 4 or 5 years when its time to get rid of it .

 

and thats the reason theres 3 silver golf gtis within 300 mtres of where i live .

 

but on the other hand , theres 3 RSM and 3 RSC :] :mrgreen:

 

computer says what i paid for my yellow R26 and what i would get for it now show its depreciated 11% LESS than the black VW i bought at around the same time . go figure . maybe people like yellow cars after all ? :nod:

 

anyway , í agree with james may . i buy what i want , not what some one else who cant afford a new car likes :booty:

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Same with me rob. Luckily I prefer very minimalist colors :P White, Silver or Gray. Nothing else :P

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I don't care what mine's worth. I don't plan to sell it - it's too good to let someone else have it!

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Griffyn rob240 and James, I agree that is the best attitude.

 

People these days look at everything as an investment and $$$, the true meaning of why we do things is lost. Sounds corny but unfortunately that is the way of the world

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Heard something to encapsulate what you're trying to say: everything is costed but nothing valued.

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I like this thread..... 8) Plenty of positive comments. :D

 

It reminds that the car I paid lots of dollars for :) .....(and is worth bugger all now :o ).....brings me bulk pleasure every time I drive it :twisted: , and I'm in no hurry to sell it off for cheap to some slackjaw :P .

 

As Griff said......its too good to let someone else have it........ :hyper:

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Rob, isn't it a fact that you are never more than 300m from a silver GTI no matter where you are?

 

An interesting theory. Is it similar to the 6 Degrees of Kevin Bacon game....? :lol:

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Teehee. Somehow, despite everything he says, he manages to collect them :popcorn:

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Rob, isn't it a fact that you are never more than 300m from a silver GTI no matter where you are?

 

well there were 6 of them at w/p the other day werent there ?? most for sale so they could upgrade to a beemer :wink:

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:P White, Silver or Gray. :P

 

red , white or blue for me ..... or yellow 8) . bright colours i like .

 

ever seen the porsche showroom ? silver / gray / black .

 

the ferrari showroom ? red / red / red .

 

the golf showroom ? sliver / silver / silver .

 

boring .

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The one regret I have in buying my Clio is that I opted for the Titanium paint.

I was offered the very first Blood Orange Clio in Australia and as I hadn't seen the colour turned it down,

ohh the shame, the shame.....

 

:D

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A coulple of my cousins purchased their cars based on resale values.....you guessed it they are golf gti owners.

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Clio 2.0, is that you??

 

No Jeffie, the topic would be more like " I can buy an XR6T for the same price as a Clio"

 

By the way, I would like to know the depreciation on a XR6T :nod:

 

http://www.carsales.com.au/all-cars/res ... r6%20turbo

 

And somehow would contain meaningless specs from fastlaps.com to try and validate what hes saying

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Apologies to the OP, but I think asking about resale is exactly missing the point. I've always made rational choices when buying a car (I've got kids, I drive an Outback), and god but I'm bored. Have been looking at A4 Avants, Golfs, etc, but they're so boooooring.

 

Next car I buy I want to make me grin like an idiot when I look at it, get into it, drive it, and (reluctantly) get out of it. Even if most of the Ks are to the orifice and back. :D

 

RS looks like exactly the ticket. :hail:

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YEP , pretty much .

 

theyre so much fun , so good and such great value used .

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Stuff rational logic when buying cars, I bought a v8 ute because I wanted one since high school, and I'm paying thousands in petrol.. but I love it.

 

For this same reason, I will get back into an RS one day. Saw the Ph1 RS Clio at the motor show and though what an awesome package for the price.

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I occasionally worry about the current value of my R26. And then I go for a drive in it.

End of worry.

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I guess it also depends on your financial situation.

 

When I bought my Clio in 2005 it was a stretch, and was my first real performance car.

 

I'm struggling trying to get started in Formula Vee, but see it as a viable thing long term, whereas Formula Ford I would have no hope funding it.

 

For the same reason I would rather own an RS rather than a more expensive performance car, as a smaller depreciation percentage on a higher value car is still more $$ down the drain for little gain if anything.

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You only realise the depreciation when you sell it. Solution.. Dont sell it! I still have my 172 Ph2 after 10 years, its worth nothing, but I love it!

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complaining about renaults ? porsches depreciate more . i lost $104,000 in 11,000klm andjust under 3 years !!!! on their most popular model in the most popular colour

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I still have my 172 Ph2 after 10 years, its worth nothing, but I love it!

 

Note quite nothing - I'm sure you could still ask $7k for it. That is what mine cost just a few months ago.

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I have a friend who knows this case >

A local business woman bought a new Maserati 2 years ago at just under $300,000.

She wanted an upgrade and the dealer offered her $90,000 trade in.

Currently she is still driving the 2 year old one around.

 

On the other hand, I benefited big time from the resale value of Renaults when I bought my lovely Clio 2nd hand in as new condition.

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Just had a read through this post as I am fairly new but was just curious as to the forums theories as to why the resale is very average compared to similar cars......but I found non of you have actually answered the question..haha! I would like to know the actual reason behind it, just as a matter of curiosity, not because I worry about what I will sell mine for when the time comes. I would just like the question answered, for me, I think part of the resale value stems from the fact that Renault is obviously grouped within the same class of French cars, that being French cars...all seem to have fairly average resale value, I believe probably because the image of poor reliability, of course this is a good thing for Renault buyers as on the whole, the mechanical package is pretty reliable, however you do get some electrical troubles and general things failing or rattling.

 

Resale is great for buyers like myself just last week when I picked up a 172 mk2, not so great for sellers but I really couldn't care less about resale if I had an absolute ball in it while I had it, I would have no regrets about losing money on the purchase price.

So in conclusion i would like to see some of you guys' opinions as to the reason behind the resale value, not just the yapping about being different, who cares, its a better car, etc etc, as being a forum member on OzRenault basically mean we are all on the same wavelength in terms of being passionate enthusiasts!

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You've got it in one mate - they're French. Australians have a distrust of Euro cars unless they're German - BMW, VW, Mercedes and Audi don't have the same issues with depreciation. Renault have a poor reliability reputation even in Europe, especially on the issue of electrics. They're not quite as dubious as Alfa Romeo in that area but pretty close!

As long as you accept it's going to be a hard car to sell when you want to move it on its not an issue.

 

It's great for someone like me who will never, ever buy a brand new car - personally I love depreciation!

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The resale is governed by two things:

 

a) The demand there is in the second-hand market for the car.

b) The price people are willing to pay for the car.

 

I don't think it comes down to reliability, or anything to do with that pseudo-image. Of all the people looking for a sports car (not a high percentage of the population), next to nobody, thinks:

 

"I need a second-hand sports car, I know, how about a Renaultsport!" If they're "car enthusiasts" in Australia they'll either be interested in something Japanese, something with a big engine that's Australian or a Golf GTI. There's just not much demand for the car, thus they can be tricky to move without taking a hit on price.

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This is what I most hate about Renault.

 

Seeing my Gordini being valued at 25k is absolute ridiculous.

 

Starting to consider what to do hold on and see it in 2 years get 16k or upgrade in the next few months.

 

Somewhere in Sydney . . .

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It's funny Tommo because your "car enthusiast" scenario basically just described my venture into an rsc. Owned a Nissan s14a before this car due to having an obsession with Japanese cars at a young age, but the longer i owned it the longer my baser common sense guided me out of that car, i didn't like the attention it drew from the police, I didn't like the attention it drew from every drop kick in existence giving me the "do a burnout" gesture, I didn't like the fuel economy (admittedly pretty good for a turbo car its age but i cannot stand the thought of needless wasting of money on fuel for something that drives the same speed as econo boxes do every day), and i didn't like the fact that i knew i needed to modify it for it to be actually enjoyable to drive.

Most of these points basically cover my reasoning for buying an RSC, in general it looks like a tarted up small hatch, so no second looks from the police, dick heads never take a second look and only those with a clue do, which i like, it handles extremely well, which to me on Australian roads means 100x more enjoyable, has what i believe is an appropriate power to weight ratio for fast road driving, can get good economy out of it if that's what i want, and in general i don't feel like it needs much improvement in many areas. that being said i cant stop my urges for modifying it but as it is a relatively low profile car i wont be so worried about being defected for anything potentially illegal as opposed to the s14a.

 

All being said i am a minority case as i knew about these cars for years and was aware of how fun they were due to riding shot gun in Cliof1's old 182 f1. so you could say i was a little more educated than the average "car enthusiast".

 

So after all that crap above i think these cars may actually gain in value at some point as people become more aware of the cult status, for good reason. i see an increasing number of people going to track days to take their urges off the street and this culture will lead to the search for cars that are great fun on the track...the relatively low numbers and increasing awareness of renault sports may eventually lead to not so terrible resale i think.

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182 Cups are pretty much the leaders of RS resale at the moment, I'd reckon. Most good ones are fetching at least $12-13K private sale. Not a bad effort for a car that was $35Kish new, and is now 7 or 8 years old.

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At the end of the day, the other component is that they are largely unknown to the enthusiast market in Aus who all know V8 falcadores, Golf GTIs or Japanese cars.

 

THe RS200/RS250 and now RS265 should hopefully mitigate some of that.

 

In terms of selling them - you need to be patient, the right purchaser will pay a fair amount for the car, just that it takes longer for that clued up enthusiast to come along.

 

Where you get really stung is if you need to sell the car quickly - without the damand for the car you have to really drop the price to get it looked at in a hurry.

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Good question.

 

Then again why do most cars depreciate?

 

I guess the real question is - why do Renaults depreciate so quickly relative to other cars?

 

For anyone interested I have obtained from Glass's Guide a Future value report for the 250 Trophee. Anyone can buy one.

 

Essentially its a table with 2 variables - age and mileage. The older the car the lower the value (everyone knows that). Ditto the greater the mileage.

 

After that's all said and done I have bought and sold quite a few cars over the last 5 years. I have to do this because of the relative high mileage of my cars and I try to move each car on before it clocks up too many kays to make it hard to sell. You only need to look at carsales to see those 5 yrs old car with 150,000 listed for months on end with no buyers despite the low price.

 

With that experience I would add my observation that with the advent of the internet my view is that glass's guide, red book etc don't count for much. The thing that buyers look for, the ONLY thing they look for is - which is the cheapest car for that year and mileage. Forget the options (no one wants to pay for them).

 

Every buyer checks the red book and then starts bargaining based on the lowest price in the red book.

 

Therein lies the problem. If you have a new car like the 265 how does the red book determine what is the market value?

 

When you sell your car carsales asks that you report the price. Presumably they then get passed to red book and glass's guide.

 

Hands up anyone who reported a lower figure because the buyer was trying to avoid paying a lower stamp duty. Now go kick yourself. You've lowered the red bk/glass guide estimate of the car for everyone else.

 

This ridiculous situation was brought home to me when I decided to unload my Q5 in readiness for the then pending 265. Q5s had only been in the market for 12-18 months then. There were so few sales and yet Red Bk and Glass's both had estimated values. Of course the values were way, way too low. Buyers would come see the car and make an offer based on the values in these guides and my response was - go try to find one at that price.

 

I ended up selling it for significantly higher than the price in the guides.

 

So here's the thing - when the owners of current models start unloading their cars please PLEASE do not un-report your sale price. Everyone else pays for it if you do.

 

That said, sporty cars (not super cars though) depreciate less quickly then luxury cars as a rule. There's always some potential box racer hanging out for a used sports car (RS included) then say a BMW 7 series. You think renaults are bad? 7 series BMs and S class mercs go over the cliff after 3 years once the lease is up and the cars are unloaded. These cars are driven by execs and paid for my their employers and none of them want a used car.

 

So enjoy your RS and forget about the resale value unless you want some boy racer's dream to come true.

 

It could be worse. You could be the owner of an S class. :)

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Was speaking to someone to day that was the owner of a 2011 Alfa Romeo Guilietta "Quadrifoglio." Beautiful car, and a really nice 1.75L turbo. Paid $39,000 for it, fully optioned up last November.

 

Owner before had paid $55,000 new, done 5,000kms in 4 months, then offered a $32,000 trade in by the dealer.

 

Renaults have it easy!

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Good question.

 

Then again why do most cars depreciate?

 

I guess the real question is - why do Renaults depreciate so quickly relative to other cars?

 

For anyone interested I have obtained from Glass's Guide a Future value report for the 250 Trophee. Anyone can buy one.

 

Essentially its a table with 2 variables - age and mileage. The older the car the lower the value (everyone knows that). Ditto the greater the mileage.

 

After that's all said and done I have bought and sold quite a few cars over the last 5 years. I have to do this because of the relative high mileage of my cars and I try to move each car on before it clocks up too many kays to make it hard to sell. You only need to look at carsales to see those 5 yrs old car with 150,000 listed for months on end with no buyers despite the low price.

 

With that experience I would add my observation that with the advent of the internet my view is that glass's guide, red book etc don't count for much. The thing that buyers look for, the ONLY thing they look for is - which is the cheapest car for that year and mileage. Forget the options (no one wants to pay for them).

 

Every buyer checks the red book and then starts bargaining based on the lowest price in the red book.

 

Therein lies the problem. If you have a new car like the 265 how does the red book determine what is the market value?

 

When you sell your car carsales asks that you report the price. Presumably they then get passed to red book and glass's guide.

 

Hands up anyone who reported a lower figure because the buyer was trying to avoid paying a lower stamp duty. Now go kick yourself. You've lowered the red bk/glass guide estimate of the car for everyone else.

 

This ridiculous situation was brought home to me when I decided to unload my Q5 in readiness for the then pending 265. Q5s had only been in the market for 12-18 months then. There were so few sales and yet Red Bk and Glass's both had estimated values. Of course the values were way, way too low. Buyers would come see the car and make an offer based on the values in these guides and my response was - go try to find one at that price.

 

I ended up selling it for significantly higher than the price in the guides.

 

So here's the thing - when the owners of current models start unloading their cars please PLEASE do not un-report your sale price. Everyone else pays for it if you do.

 

That said, sporty cars (not super cars though) depreciate less quickly then luxury cars as a rule. There's always some potential box racer hanging out for a used sports car (RS included) then say a BMW 7 series. You think renaults are bad? 7 series BMs and S class mercs go over the cliff after 3 years once the lease is up and the cars are unloaded. These cars are driven by execs and paid for my their employers and none of them want a used car.

 

So enjoy your RS and forget about the resale value unless you want some boy racer's dream to come true.

 

It could be worse. You could be the owner of an S class. :)

 

I'd like to say that the RenaultSports generally do well.

 

I sold my 250CT at 22months old for $37,000. It was also the highest mileage at 34,000kms.

 

Popular new. Popular used.

 

So, don't go rushing out to buy a 5 Series GT.

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So, 6 months old, RS250 AGP, spare Steev 19" wheel,with genuine Bridgestone tyre etc as well as the stupid get you home.

4000 kms as of today.

Whats it worth ?

I'm not selling, paid $51,950 for it on road, just curious.

Soon I will have to decide which of 3 cars to sell.

I need to have a reliable new car so the RS250 stays, but maybe the Sierra could go or I could have fun in the Dimma.

But I'm really curious how much the 250 has devalued since buying it 6 months ago.

Cheers

Keith

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