quangb Posted 30, December 2021 Report Share Posted 30, December 2021 Hi everyone, Just looking to see if anyone would have an idea of my how safe/strong the circa 15 year old Clio 172 would be in today's safety standards or even just general accidents. The other half has a thing about safety of older cars and especially after attending a defensive driver safety course. So the 4 yo hasn't travelled in my car at all. We have just had bub no 2 and so consideration is being had for the 4 yo to start riding in my car to free up car resources. With a toddler seat of course. At the moment I'm staring down the barrel of having to sell and get a new car, which has its plusses and minuses. Financially and spatially it would make sense to keep the Clio. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckovski Posted 30, December 2021 Report Share Posted 30, December 2021 That's a very difficult question to answer with any accuracy. All I can say that will hopefully make you more confident (which I believe would be a reasonable confidence): The Laguna II was the safest tested car at the time (I think 2001/2002). It was then followed by the Megane II which was the safest car ever tested in ~2006. But... Probably most newer cars will be safer, probably due to degradation of components more than anything else. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
japarn Posted 30, December 2021 Report Share Posted 30, December 2021 Hi here’s the most relevant published source. Not sure if the Clio is listed https://howsafeisyourcar.com.au/files/used-car-safety-ratings-2021.pdf 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cairnsy Posted 30, December 2021 Report Share Posted 30, December 2021 Yes, I would have thought you shouldn't have an issue. The thing that is forgotten is that a performance vehicle is going to be better, in most cases, because it will do things, like braking and handling (with good tyres), better than others. Obviously a brand new vehicle, in theory, should be safer. BUT ANCAP ratings seem to be variable at best. Meaning cars like a late model Mustang rely on an old ANCAP rating and won't pass a more recent test. Jeep suffer the same issue. You wouldn't carry your kids in either of those, if you valued their safety. I would say if you keep your driver skills up, (not on public roads, go to a track day or two, with good instructors) and drive on public roads in a responsible manner, it will be the best thing you can do for your kids safety. Remember it is the grey matter, between the ears, that is the main arbitare. 3 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quangb Posted 30, December 2021 Author Report Share Posted 30, December 2021 @chuckovski@japarn@cairnsy Thanks for your replies! Yeah I know this would be a hard one to gauge hence why I wanted to ask the greater community. Some of you are more intimate with the automotive realm and may have more insights than what I can conjure up. I totally understand that performance vehicles would be typically better in terms of braking and handling. And I'm not one to stuff around on the road and am quite sensible and aware. I leave silly business to the track. So for me, its more on the unexpected impacts that could occur that the wifey has an issue with, she has faith in me as a driver just not others. And that's where age of the vehicle and design standards come more into play. I personally don't have an issue with taking him in the car, I've seen some accidents with them and they appear to hold up quite well. Unfortunately @japarn there isn't even a renault listed in that pdf 😞 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
japarn Posted 30, December 2021 Report Share Posted 30, December 2021 36 minutes ago, quangb said: @chuckovski@japarn@cairnsy Thanks for your replies! Yeah I know this would be a hard one to gauge hence why I wanted to ask the greater community. Some of you are more intimate with the automotive realm and may have more insights than what I can conjure up. I totally understand that performance vehicles would be typically better in terms of braking and handling. And I'm not one to stuff around on the road and am quite sensible and aware. I leave silly business to the track. So for me, its more on the unexpected impacts that could occur that the wifey has an issue with, she has faith in me as a driver just not others. And that's where age of the vehicle and design standards come more into play. I personally don't have an issue with taking him in the car, I've seen some accidents with them and they appear to hold up quite well. Unfortunately @japarn there isn't even a renault listed in that pdf 😞 I’d also think about the driving scenarios that you find yourself in. If you’re mainly in 40km/h zones then it shouldn’t matter Not sure what state you’re in, but in Victoria I can interrogate the TAC road fatality database to get an idea of death statistics for drivers and passengers in my LGA over time. Thankfully my LGA has very few (which goes hand-in-hand with 40km/h speed limits) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt205 Posted 30, December 2021 Report Share Posted 30, December 2021 Current safety standards seem to be more focused on driver aids, automated systems etc, none of which means a pinch of shit if you are the vehicle being collected by another. When launched the Clio 2 was 5 star ncap from memory. I personally had no issue putting my 7-8 yo (at the time) in the Clio. He's just got his P's, guess what he's been given to drive? I get the concern for sure, but you also need to live with a modicum of risk acceptance. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quangb Posted 31, December 2021 Author Report Share Posted 31, December 2021 @japarn @Matt205 Totally get you about speed, for us it would be varied, we have a lot of major roads around us. Im in VIC I'll try and find that info for my LGA. I agree with you about the focus of the ANCAP and how it's changed. Hence the reason why my wife has got the concerns about collision safety and old cars. Still appears to be a big difference in how cars are built as well. https://www.ancap.com.au/media-and-gallery/releases/new-analysis-fatality-rate-four-times-higher-in-an-older-vehicle-0e2f9e Granted the example is a 1998 corolla and I feel that a 2005 clio would definately be better built. But whether the same would result against a 2015 corolla or say a 2015 clio. Its hard to say at least at face value (the Clio does look old) that the 172 would hold up. The data suggests the clio is right on the cusp of when builds started to change. You've got a lucky boy! Id love to do the same if the Clio was still going by the time mine started to drive. I guess at the end of the day, I'm looking for an excuse to try and keep the 172 I've only had it 3 years and have put some time into it and really starting to get to know the car, "shortened" more by COVID. Im just feeling sad that I may have to let it go at this point. 😔 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hamstrung Posted 31, December 2021 Report Share Posted 31, December 2021 If it was me, I’d keep the Clio for fun driving and get a nice-ish “beater” for carting kids and stuff, like a 2010-12 Suzuki Kizashi in manual, which is a bit bigger, heavier and more modern. Then I wouldn’t be scared to park said beater on the street. (Also, a Megane 225 feels like it’s hewn from solid stuff, which is probably an impression more than reality) 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckovski Posted 31, December 2021 Report Share Posted 31, December 2021 7 hours ago, hamstrung said: If it was me, I’d keep the Clio for fun driving and get a nice-ish “beater” for carting kids and stuff, like a 2010-12 Suzuki Kizashi in manual, which is a bit bigger, heavier and more modern. Then I wouldn’t be scared to park said beater on the street. (Also, a Megane 225 feels like it’s hewn from solid stuff, which is probably an impression more than reality) No, as I mentioned that was the safest car in the world when it was released, and was for a long time afterwards. The irony of what you said though is the significant crumple zones! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hamstrung Posted 1, January 2022 Report Share Posted 1, January 2022 14 hours ago, chuckovski said: No, as I mentioned that was the safest car in the world when it was released, and was for a long time afterwards. The irony of what you said though is the significant crumple zones! Sorry, I missed that - saw the Laguna bit and missed the Megane! I always felt the little one was safe in the back of the 225, with the added bonus my loud K-tec exhaust put her to sleep within 5 minutes every time 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckovski Posted 1, January 2022 Report Share Posted 1, January 2022 3 hours ago, hamstrung said: Sorry, I missed that - saw the Laguna bit and missed the Megane! I always felt the little one was safe in the back of the 225, with the added bonus my loud K-tec exhaust put her to sleep within 5 minutes every time Haha perfect! I've been amazed at how sports cars can send a kid to sleep. That's far more important than a crash test rating IMHO. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
griffyn Posted 4, January 2022 Report Share Posted 4, January 2022 Having seen a few of these bent and beaten now, I would think a 172 is a fine place to be in an unfortunate situation. They're not huge, but they're pretty damn solid for how big they are, and they do the right things to protect those inside them. BUT They're 20~ish years old now, and safety tech has come quite a way in the meantime. If safety is your significantly primary concern, go something newer. If there are other considerations (like how often the kid(s) will be in it, financial, timing, fun-factor) then you're the only one who can really arbitrate on what the best option is. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
63x1092 Posted 4, January 2022 Report Share Posted 4, January 2022 While my kids were in primary school during the summer all they wanted was for me to pick them up in my 1960 Renault Floride convertible that had no seat belts in the back, otherwise it was my series of 172’s and 182’s I’ve had over the years. Tell the Mrs, no, I’m keeping the Clio, end of conversation. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quangb Posted 6, January 2022 Author Report Share Posted 6, January 2022 Thanks for your replies everyone. Regardless of how much want to keep the car, it's no longer an option for us and our circumstances. Battle lost but is war is not over, so I20N or Fiesta ST? 😁 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
havingfun Posted 6, January 2022 Report Share Posted 6, January 2022 Went and had a look at the I20N yesterday with the daughter , she is looking for something small and sporty ( not much avail under $40k new ) Looked nicely finished, I didn't get to drive it she did and thought is was great ( though she's not much driver ) Was told up to 8 month wait for it but even that is a guess from what the sales man said. I asled the salesman if they come with a LSD , he said no , but the specifications say it does. A mate has the ST , that is a cracker of a car to drive. Don't believe he's had any issues outside of a leaky front shock and a intermittent slight buzz/rattle around the back some were which the dealer cant find ( car gets driven hard but not abused ). Not sure if you can turn off all the nanny features , can remember him saying the ABS was giving grief on the track, or maybe he didn't know how to disable it at the time. If that's important to you. Also didn't ask if it all can be turned off in the I20N 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quangb Posted 7, January 2022 Author Report Share Posted 7, January 2022 On 06/01/2022 at 11:38 AM, havingfun said: Went and had a look at the I20N yesterday with the daughter , she is looking for something small and sporty ( not much avail under $40k new ) Looked nicely finished, I didn't get to drive it she did and thought is was great ( though she's not much driver ) Was told up to 8 month wait for it but even that is a guess from what the sales man said. I asled the salesman if they come with a LSD , he said no , but the specifications say it does. A mate has the ST , that is a cracker of a car to drive. Don't believe he's had any issues outside of a leaky front shock and a intermittent slight buzz/rattle around the back some were which the dealer cant find ( car gets driven hard but not abused ). Not sure if you can turn off all the nanny features , can remember him saying the ABS was giving grief on the track, or maybe he didn't know how to disable it at the time. If that's important to you. Also didn't ask if it all can be turned off in the I20N Thanks for the reply! I20N definately has a LSD. Good to hear that she found it a good drive. I have done a test drive and found it a bit laggy from stop but if she managed to drive it fine then it may just be me. I started to get used to it near the end of my drive. I'm trying to line up an ST for a test. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckovski Posted 7, January 2022 Report Share Posted 7, January 2022 11 hours ago, quangb said: Thanks for the reply! I20N definately has a LSD. Good to hear that she found it a good drive. I have done a test drive and found it a bit laggy from stop but if she managed to drive it fine then it may just be me. I started to get used to it near the end of my drive. I'm trying to line up an ST for a test. The new ST has matrix LEDs - are you driving the pre-prefacelift model? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hamstrung Posted 8, January 2022 Report Share Posted 8, January 2022 2 hours ago, chuckovski said: The new ST has matrix LEDs - are you driving the pre-prefacelift model? Reckon if the car's not already built, it won't end up getting the matrix LEDs... manufacturers are un-specifying them due to lack of chips Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckovski Posted 8, January 2022 Report Share Posted 8, January 2022 10 hours ago, hamstrung said: Reckon if the car's not already built, it won't end up getting the matrix LEDs... manufacturers are un-specifying them due to lack of chips Argh that's frustrating! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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