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DrinkBeer
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Hi Everyone,

 

I have finally gotton round to replacing my beloved 07 Colt Ralliart which i lost in the 'Great Perth Storm' last year and am looking for some advice. I am trying to decide between a 2007 XR4 (28000kms) or a 2009 RS 197 (8000kms) and want to know the cost benefit of, if ponying up the extra cash for the 197 would be worth it? I drove both cars yesterday and was suprised by the XR4 - great little car handle well etc.. I only went to drive the 197 out of curiosity to see what the grail of hot hatches was actually like - turns out its a pretty tight unit and enough to get me into negotiating firstly with the missus then with the man with the keys.That little 197 bastard!

 

So my questions really revolves around at what point would the cost out weigh the benefit if i could get the XR4 for $15k. Also I cant find out much info on 197 pricing anywhere so am unsure if the amount i have negotiated with the dealer is a good buy or not.

 

Eagerly awaiting responses,

 

DrinkBeer

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Welcome beer drinker!

 

The 197 is newer with lower kms and would still be under warranty. It looks better and goes better than the XR4 as well so would definitely be my choice. It really is in a different class to the XR4. The XR4 is more directly comparable to a phII Clio but still significantly underpowered. You can make easy power from subtle mods though (from what I've read) but that depends if you're into that sort of thing or not.

 

To answer your question directly, if you're getting the 197 for around $25k or so, I'd be going that route.

 

Good luck with your choice 8)

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Thanks for the reply Walkie.

 

I have been able to negotiate lower than $25k which is why the 197 went from dream to possible reality. It also still has 2.5 years left on its NCW.

 

With it being a Saturday there wasnt much time to spend in both cars and both left me with more questions than answers. Which car is easier to deal with day to day? downside of the arguement which had me leaning for the XR4 was it wont travel too many kilometres. I live close to work and have a Diesel Subi Outback for the long hauls.

 

Are both vehicles on par with reliability issues?

 

DrinkBeer

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We have a number of members upgrade to RS Clio from XR4, and I suspect all would have great difficulty going back.

 

If you're after something fun and rewarding, it's gotta be the Clio. They simply eat corners like nothing else I've driven (and one particular member here still reckons a Clio is more fun stock-for-stock than a GT3 or EVO, right Rob?)

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Can any of those members comment on the difference? I love forums for this very reason - unbiased info.

 

Sorry for the excessive contributions on my first day but as much as I love my Subi i really miss my hot hatches.

 

Also does anyone take their dogs in their RS's? I dont need the back seats and am keen hear anyones experiences on how they handle dogs in the back of their Clio's?

 

DrinkBeer

(Currently drinking beer!)

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Our dog loves the back of our two RS vehicles, a 172 and a 225 - except when we start having fun. Grab handles simply don't work when you've got 4 legs :)

 

I, on the other hand, aren't too fond of her hopping in, as she leaves a fine coating of white hair on the seats.

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197 for under $25K - no-brainer surely!

 

I'm a huge fan of the Fiesta, they are extremely well-built, super-durable and cheap to run but the RS is bigger, more comfortable, more bespoke and more fun.

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As someone who's had no great love (or hate) for Renaults or French cars in general before buying one, when I started to head in the hot-hatch direction, I looked into the XR4. On paper I didn't see a great deal of difference between it and the RSCs, but after popping my head in a couple I didn't even bother finding one for a drive...

 

The interior! It's awful! I don't know if you can get them in different colours or something, but the two I saw were cheap looking and ugly. I'm not saying the Clio has one of the all-time great interiors or anything (I love it but I've come from a 1990 Nissan Skyline, so that's not really any big surprise), but it is comfortable and, at the very least, not hideous and chintzy. I simply couldn't picture myself hopping into the Ford's pews day-in and day-out with a smile on my face.

 

That said, and putting the now undeniable owner's bias to one side, 10k is a lot of cheddar... However, if you're looking at the older XR4, why not look at an older RSC? As a second hand purchaser, let Renault's not-so-stellar resale value work for you!

 

If you want to balance the bias (because of course there's always bias), go and ask this same question at an XR4 forum. I'd be curious to know what they think of their car compared to the RSC...

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I think the 07 XR4 doesn't have an age-equivalent Clio option and a low km 182 would be similarly priced to the younger Ford.

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Always go for as low as you can. Failing that, ask for extra kit.

Never the less, 197 - 8000ks - 2.5yrs warrnty - under $25k = GIDDYUP!

Sorry, like the XR4, but this is apples and oranges.

Comes down to what you can afford...a car you like to drive...or... a car you WANT to drive.

Good luck, get the 197, see you around here : )

 

WOLF

ps: then do what i'm planning to do.

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There are zero RS clios for sale in WA so sourcing an older 182 isnt an option. So its back to the $10k debate and the low kms XR4.

 

If the 10k means there is a significant extra risk of you having to sell the Clio due to your financial situation, then maybe it's worth a debate. But if there's no risk of you having to sell, I can't see you regretting stumping up the extra cash.

 

Anyway, you've driven both, maybe drive them again and decide whether it's worth it TO YOU (easy to get caught up in the thoughts of others, we all do it...). I personally don't think you'll be disappointed with either.

 

RE the power issue, I don't know about weight, but they both have 200Nm from their 2ltr engines, so around town at less than 4-5k rpm (aka how you'll use the engine 90% of the time) they'd be quite similar I imagine.

 

P.S. I was originally looking at getting an MA63 Supra, and all the nice ones were in WA... Swings and round-abouts I guess.

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Owner of both an XR4 (which is for sale) and a 197 here.

 

Have to say that the XR4 is a fantastic car. It didn't win its class a couple of time in MOTOR BFYB for nothing.

 

Bought the XR4 for the missus to run around in for basically the same reasons as yourself. Could get a good low mileage car for not much more than a high km 182. And the missus wouldn't let me have another Clio at the time...

 

If you check out the Fiesta XR4 forum, there's a dump of the 07 BFYB. The XR4 showed virtually the same corner speeds around Wakefield as the Megane R26. So the thing handles... obviously down a bit on top end power compared to the 197 but very tunable. Try 10bhp at the flywheel from a K&N 57i!!! Do the same mod on a 197 and you'll lose 10bhp :) You can easily get 180bhp out of the engine with simple bolt ons.

 

In summary the XR4 feels more like an old school but slightly more modern 172/182 to drive. Quite torquey and feels small. Well built though, and the timing chain is nice to have as it cuts out the need for timing belt changes (as per the F4R in the Clio). The 197 feels bigger, a bit lardly when low in the rev range, but ballistic up high and the chassis is on another level.

 

They're both cracking cars and you won't be disappointed with either. Hope this helps.

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^^^ WOO! Congrats 8)

 

Pics when you get her, please :)

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Aaah, know the car well. Welcome aboard and congrats on the purchase from a fellow WA RS'er! I have been driving a 200 Trophee the last few weeks and they are an amazing car. Great decision and enjoy the corners!

 

Cheers,

 

Justin.

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Owner of both an XR4 (which is for sale) and a 197 here.

 

Have to say that the XR4 is a fantastic car. It didn't win its class a couple of time in MOTOR BFYB for nothing.

 

Bought the XR4 for the missus to run around in for basically the same reasons as yourself. Could get a good low mileage car for not much more than a high km 182. And the missus wouldn't let me have another Clio at the time...

 

If you check out the Fiesta XR4 forum, there's a dump of the 07 BFYB. The XR4 showed virtually the same corner speeds around Wakefield as the Megane R26. So the thing handles... obviously down a bit on top end power compared to the 197 but very tunable. Try 10bhp at the flywheel from a K&N 57i!!! Do the same mod on a 197 and you'll lose 10bhp :) You can easily get 180bhp out of the engine with simple bolt ons.

 

In summary the XR4 feels more like an old school but slightly more modern 172/182 to drive. Quite torquey and feels small. Well built though, and the timing chain is nice to have as it cuts out the need for timing belt changes (as per the F4R in the Clio). The 197 feels bigger, a bit lardly when low in the rev range, but ballistic up high and the chassis is on another level.

 

They're both cracking cars and you won't be disappointed with either. Hope this helps.

 

Couldn't have put it better myself. You want a great, objective summary of both cars, Moosey has nailed it right here. Having owned an XR4, I can vouch for the sensational handling. On the other hand, I did find it lacking in power, especially at the top end. It was a great city car, though. But, as somebody else said earlier, Clio RS and XR4 are like apples and oranges. The Clio is definitely a level up in terms of outright performance. Having driven both, I can safely say the Clio RS handles slightly better, but has more pace off the line. As for the interior, the XR4 is sub-par, but having seen the Clio, I can't say it's far ahead. At the end of the day, the RS is going to give you more thrills (but you wouldn't have gone wrong with an XR4, either).

 

Congratulations on the purchase :)

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Missus has dragged me down south for the long weekend here in WA. I spent the last 2 days trying to convince her Clio would be ok to take down south. Its clearly big enough to fit 3 dogs in the back.

 

Last 2 days have been great learning about the car. Loving the exhaust note coming from the clio compared to the Rcolt.

 

I agree the interior is better than the xr4. Also the lower rev punchyness is a positive over the xr4. I love the clio but credit where credit is due - the xr4 for the pennies is a smashing buy. Just a shame I'll now be thinking about it when its in the rear view mirror!

 

DrinkBeer

 

Pics when I get back home I promise

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