acidwestern Posted 27, April 2014 Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 Now I wouldn’t normally post something like this, or appreciate reading a post such as this, but this is an exceptional case and please have a read. As many of you may have realised, ozclio03, put up his quite nice Clio 182 Cup F1 for sale a few weeks ago. You may also realise I was keen to buy it and put a deposit on the vehicle. Following placing a deposit on the vehicle, I put my own 172 on the market and also confirmed a buyer for it very quickly. Just as ozclio03 had agreed in our contract, I agreed with my buyer to get the RWC and the sale could be finalised when that had all been completed. I had been given a written receipt for the agreement stating the obligations each party was to fulfill. Things were going smoothly. Until ozclio03 turned into an incredibly dishonest bloke. While at the time I thought ozclio03 had been polite and a genuine guy, and he had throughout the entire process, it wasn’t until the Easter weekend that things went sour. His car, the 182, according to his words was at a workshop getting things sorted for the roadworthy certificate he was to be providing. He told me that the car would be there over the long weekend while the shop, his mate’s shop, was closed for the long weekend. He said he was going camping over the weekend and wouldn’t be in touch until after the long weekend. Sounds pretty fair don’t you think? On Wednesday the 23rd of April, 11 days after placing a deposit for the car, and 7 days after confirming the sale of mine, I received a call saying, “Riley, I have a problem, I just can’t sell the car.” The following 24 hours involved me arguing each parties contractual obligations, including the obligations I had as the seller or my own vehicle, and the fact that I had the legal right to his vehicle, just as my buyer had the legal right to mine. On the Wednesday evening I went around to his place to discuss the situation and noticed a few interesting things along the way. The car was sitting on the spare set of wheels on semi’s and there was a racing sticker on the paint of the passenger rear quarter panel. I thought this was odd given the car should have just come back from a workshop getting a roadworthy. The legal side of things didn't phase him and said he would rather fight and lose than give up. I guess in his situation, I am not suprised by this, a legal battle would last months and he very well realised I wouldn't pursue. Anyway, being too busy to deal with a legal battle, I gave up on the car after consulting my buyer who frankly thought my situation was a bit of a joke. I took back my deposit and while the whole process had been unenjoyable, I wasn’t bitter. You might notice this from my post in my for sale thread - check it out. That was until I got a message from a valued member on this forum with whom I thank for the piece of knowledge he gave me. THE LONG EASTER WEEKEND, OZCLIO DROVE THE CAR THAT I HAD CONFIRMED BUYING, FROM MELBOURNE TO BATHURST TO PARTICIPATE IN THE EASTER SPEED WEEKEND. At a mate’s ‘shop you say? What a complete an utter lie. That explains the other wheels and the racing sticker. You are a truly untrustworthy man and DO NOT DESERVE TO BE A MEMBER OF THIS COMMUNITY. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Posted 27, April 2014 Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 Holy Christ! That's bloody bad mate, hope it all works out for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddolomite Posted 27, April 2014 Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 Shocker mate! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tension Posted 27, April 2014 Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 Dishonest scumbags are everywhere, sorry to hear about that sh*tty experience you went through. I know you were excited about the new car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dish Posted 27, April 2014 Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 Well Riley, I reckon you were kinda lucky in the end. Thinking back about how ozclio treated his car at Winton during the 2012 Nationals, and the numerous track days it would have done in similar fashion, it would definitely be a case of 'buyer beware'. But I'm sure that won't remove the sour taste left behind. Thank you for taking the time to share your side of the story. I'm intrigued to hear ozclio's side... if we ever get to hear it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerrickC Posted 27, April 2014 Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 Poor to see a member of the community do such thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R182 Posted 27, April 2014 Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 Yep, a sad story indeed. The only good thing is that you managed not to end up Clio-less all together I guess. Good luck with the plans for your car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaesh Posted 27, April 2014 Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 Kind of shocked to be honest One should not expect to be treat with just disrespect and be lied to in such a manner. As dish has already said consider yourself lucky at least that you didn't end up getting it because just maybe the car would of been more trouble then fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krappy Posted 27, April 2014 Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 Sad to hear that a member of this community would treat another in this manner... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanerr88 Posted 27, April 2014 Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 The way I see it.. It would be upsetting but I think you're being a little harsh with "you complete and utter lying, disgusting, scumbag, etc..." He didn't try to do the track day and sell it to you without telling you. He changed his mind and he wants to keep the car. No one is going to mount a time consuming and expensive legal fight over a $10000 car. Get over it, there is plenty more cars out there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homerlovesbeer Posted 27, April 2014 Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 Actually the deal was still on while it was being tracked at Bathurst. The lie was it was in the shop. The change of mind didn't occur till after. Bad luck, as I'm sure you've heard plenty of times by now, there will be others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acidwestern Posted 27, April 2014 Author Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 Should clarify, not having the car doesn't bother me at all. The fact is, with an event like that booked, why would you sell the car and not even notify me that you were about to drive it 10 hours each way to a motorsport event in another state. And above all lie and tell me that it is in a workshop through that time. That tells me he never had any intention to sell it, yet if he did, I would never have known about the car being at Bathurst. Like I said I feel I was very diplimatic throughout and didn't speak a negative word of him until I found out about this Bathurst business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harbo Posted 27, April 2014 Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 That's as dishonest as a person could. If we were in game of thrones ned stark would have his head. Think you dodged a bullet in the end, that'll be the last time he advertises on this forum.... Admins? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trixie Posted 27, April 2014 Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 Maybe he booked Bathurst a while back, maybe he was in two minds as to whether to sell, then surprised when a buyer popped up so quickly, maybe he then decided at the last minute to go and have a last fling then maybe realised he couldn't sell because either he'd misrepresented the product or maybe simply changed his mind. Some people are genuine swindlers, others just not very good at being ideal characters much of the time. Sure you were misled but as Dish says you may very well have dodged a bullet. Strong words given your good fortune perhaps? You've certainly affected the potential saleability of his car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SupremeMoFo Posted 27, April 2014 Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 The way I see it.. It would be upsetting but I think you're being a little harsh with "you complete and utter lying, disgusting, scumbag, etc..." He didn't try to do the track day and sell it to you without telling you. He changed his mind and he wants to keep the car. No one is going to mount a time consuming and expensive legal fight over a $10000 car. Get over it, there is plenty more cars out there. I'd agree with you if Acid hadn't already lined up a buyer for his existing car. Given that he had, it's a dog move by ozclio03 to renege on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acidwestern Posted 27, April 2014 Author Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 Maybe he booked Bathurst a while back, maybe he was in two minds as to whether to sell, then surprised when a buyer popped up so quickly, maybe he then decided at the last minute to go and have a last fling then maybe realised he couldn't sell because either he'd misrepresented the product or maybe simply changed his mind. Some people are genuine swindlers, others just not very good at being ideal characters much of the time. Sure you were misled but as Dish says you may very well have dodged a bullet. Strong words given your good fortune perhaps? You've certainly affected the potential saleability of his car. I understand you fully trixie. However all you have done is press further emphasis on my point. If you were selling your car and had such an event booked would you lie to the person that has just put a deposit on your car? Would you say it is in a workshop getting the RWC? No reasonable person would go behind the back of the buyer and "have a last fling." Once again I was completely reasonable and despite the events said he was a polite guy in person. I don't appreciate being blatantly lied to, and if I had been informed of all this, I would not have left a deposit for the car. Strong words - yes, put yourself in my shoes and call them unjustified - no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pricey Posted 27, April 2014 Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 Sorry to hear this story Riley. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wade Posted 27, April 2014 Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 Dog act. If a deposit has been taken the car is sold full stop. Taking the car to a track event afterwards is downright dodgy. If it was up to me I would ban him. A forum like this, and the transactions that it facilitates, is based on trust. To have a member be so blatantly misleading and deceptive undermines this trust, and if we don't act upon it we further damage that trust Ban him.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dish Posted 27, April 2014 Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 Dog act. If a deposit has been taken the car is sold full stop. Taking the car to a track event afterwards is downright dodgy. If it was up to me I would ban him. A forum like this, and the transactions that it facilitates, is based on trust. To have a member be so blatantly misleading and deceptive undermines this trust, and if we don't act upon it we further damage that trust Ban him.... Points noted, and we are discussing this behind the scenes to determine which course to take. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R182 Posted 27, April 2014 Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 ... Some people are genuine swindlers, others just not very good at being ideal characters much of the time ... Brilliant ... I'm going to start quoting you at work Trixie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dweezle Posted 27, April 2014 Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 I agree it sounds a bit funny, but i honestly think publicly name bashing someone is just not on. Surely he would have some form of Legal action against not just yourself but the forum owner for Slander. I have seen this happen with a business on another forum when someone bad mouthed them publicly. The owner of the Forum had Legal Action taken against him. Unless there was a written contract regarding the sale of the car i also do not believe you would have any legal strength anyway? This seems very child like and every one is turning it into a Witch Hunt. We do not know the full story. Just one side of it. Either way, i feel it dirties up the taste of the forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanielG Posted 27, April 2014 Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 Unless there was a written contract regarding the sale of the car i also do not believe you would have any legal strength anyway? Read the OP more thoroughly Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave200 Posted 27, April 2014 Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 I agree it sounds a bit funny, but i honestly think publicly name bashing someone is just not on. Surely he would have some form of Legal action against not just yourself but the forum owner for Slander. I have seen this happen with a business on another forum when someone bad mouthed them publicly. The owner of the Forum had Legal Action taken against him. Unless there was a written contract regarding the sale of the car i also do not believe you would have any legal strength anyway? This seems very child like and every one is turning it into a Witch Hunt. We do not know the full story. Just one side of it. Either way, i feel it dirties up the taste of the forum. Ozclio03 doesnt have a leg to stand on. He entered a legal binding contract with OP for the sale of the Clio. He is within his rights to vent. Also this is a community forum run via donations, there is no one to take to court Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deb Posted 27, April 2014 Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 ozclio03 is most welcome to tell his side of the story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wade Posted 27, April 2014 Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 I also strongly encourage ozclio to tell his story....... Dweezle, the contract doesn't need to be written to be legally binding and it's not slander unless its untrue The OP was very careful to check and double check his information. Prior to posting.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanielG Posted 27, April 2014 Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 Just one thing to point out is that they did have a signed contract stating the car was sold, deposit paid with balance due once RWC was completed, so yes. Riley is just lucky it was my friend buying his car and not some random off the street who I'm sure would not have been as understanding... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dweezle Posted 27, April 2014 Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 If a person thinks that you have defamed them and takes you to court, they have to prove that three of these things have happened: That the words were capable of a defamatory meaning as understood by ordinary members of society. Defamatory meaning could be anything which harms the person, in their reputation, their business or in the way other people treat them. The law does not say that the plaintiff must show actual proof of being harmed; it is enough that the false statement could have led to harm. That the words identify him as the person defamed. It is not necessary that he should have been specifically named. If he can show the court that a reasonable person would take the words to refer to him, he will probably have a good case. Groups of people (such as small companies or not for profit associations) can sue for defamation if they can demonstrate that the words identified them as a group. That the words or pictures have been published, that is heard or seen by a third person. The first person is the one talking or writing (you), the second person is the person being talked or written about (the plaintiff), the third person is anyone else who may hear or read the offending matter (such as a reader or listener). There is no civil defamation if the words, however bad or untrue, are spoken or written only to the person about whom they are made. Sounds to me like he would have quite a case all wrapped up. But anyway, So you all think this is appropriate to be published in a public gallery? I am not saying he did or did not do the right thing, just that this makes this usually friendly place feel like a bullying ring. All these calls to have him banned etc?? Clearly i am in the minority so i will stop commenting in this thread. Also, yeah i somehow missed the part about the contract? I even went looking before i commented to see i could see it? Must of been too early. Apologies. I agree that you might have been lucky then to just get the deposit back from the seller and be able to walk away if he is such a horrible person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SupremeMoFo Posted 27, April 2014 Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 Also, yeah i somehow missed the part about the contract?It's quite clear, if it is true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUSGO Posted 27, April 2014 Report Share Posted 27, April 2014 Sh#mefull act on the seller's part to do anything other than prepare the car for handover in advertised condition. No bullying here. It is a sorry day for our forum members to have deals like this take place and it should be exposed just as it has been. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R182 Posted 28, April 2014 Report Share Posted 28, April 2014 I'm reasonably sure the mods would be rather frantically discussing how to proceed behind the scenes so they can lock this thread as soon as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acidwestern Posted 28, April 2014 Author Report Share Posted 28, April 2014 Clarified the OP with regards to the agreement we had and especially the point of the agreement I had. As danielg said, Riley is just lucky it was my friend buying his car and not some random off the street who I'm sure would not have been as understanding... ...as well as this, I was lucky I hadn't already transferred my car across, because at the end of the day Wednesday the 23rd it would have been ready to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acidwestern Posted 28, April 2014 Author Report Share Posted 28, April 2014 In response to some other people's posts - I would also like to hear ozclio's side of the story. Was it just a case of he changed his mind, did he have any intention to sell at all? Was he ever going to tell me about his trip to another state? These are what I would like to know, and all I ask is a reasonable explanation, which I am doubtful of getting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommo Posted 28, April 2014 Report Share Posted 28, April 2014 which I am doubtful of getting. So in lieu of this; we should probably move on/bask in this one for a while: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=22865 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoboJoe Posted 28, April 2014 Report Share Posted 28, April 2014 Hello everyone, Unfortunately I was on the other end of this kerfuffle. What eventuated was a waste of everyone's time and money, and could have ended very unpleasantly. The fact that Riley was lied to with the seller responsibilities also unfulfilled tainted this even further. Kosta Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wade Posted 28, April 2014 Report Share Posted 28, April 2014 which I am doubtful of getting. So in lieu of this; we should probably move on/bask in this one for a while: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=22865 Rofl..... One of the classic threads on OZRS ...... Up there with the renaltboi thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icecup Posted 28, April 2014 Report Share Posted 28, April 2014 I'm surprised Ozclio03 hasn't responded yet. Unless he has something material to say, it looks a like a pretty strong case for Riley. Shameful act, if this is the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R182 Posted 28, April 2014 Report Share Posted 28, April 2014 ... Up there with the renaltboi thread ... and one of the great disappointments of OZRS is that renaultboi has never re-emerged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SupremeMoFo Posted 28, April 2014 Report Share Posted 28, April 2014 Group buy? That's how the internet works doesn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slav888 Posted 28, April 2014 Report Share Posted 28, April 2014 Group buy? That's how the internet works doesn't it? OOOOoooo.. fiberglass shaft.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimMelb Posted 28, April 2014 Report Share Posted 28, April 2014 I would just be annoyed and frustrated if it were me that got shafted on the deal. At the end of the day it sounds like the transaction wasn't meant to be. Given its history you are better off. RWC are a joke anyway. Nothing beats a full mechanical check, and that should be done prior to handing over any deposit if it were me. It's buyer beware. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClioF1 Posted 28, April 2014 Report Share Posted 28, April 2014 I'm keen to see ozclio03's side of the story before forming an opinion. Agree with the comment above though that maybe it wasn't meant to be, and everyone is better off with the outcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wade Posted 28, April 2014 Report Share Posted 28, April 2014 But being better off isn't the point mate..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daz7 Posted 28, April 2014 Report Share Posted 28, April 2014 But being better off isn't the point mate..... I reckon he needs a gearbox left on his doorstep.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xeno182 Posted 28, April 2014 Report Share Posted 28, April 2014 Surely enough has been said, yes the seller did the wrong thing, I'm sure others have done a lot worse, it's now water under the bridge, it's not the end of the world, move on and find yourself another car, there is no other option. This thread is turning into Ozrenaultsport's Oscar Pistorius trial.....it has the potential to cause tension and arguments amongst other forum members, just not worth it in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bremund Posted 28, April 2014 Report Share Posted 28, April 2014 Agreed enough has been said, and I think Ozclio03 is the only one who has anything to add. Ozclio03, if you are going to reply please start a new thread and we'll merge it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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